• This is the fifth of a series of things that we hear at church on a regular basis that I wish people would stop saying. They are not big, honkin’, scary things, just little expressions that you hear frequently that just don’t quite work. (Grammatically or doctrinally)
“Hey ‘Bish’, how’s it going?” It happened all the time, and I cringed every time. One of my pet-peeves. I always let it slide, but in my mind I would say,
“Bish? The title is ‘Bishop’, thank you very much”.
Not because I was an egomaniac – I had felt this way long before I was ever called to be a bishop – but out of the respect for the calling.
Little thing? Perhaps. But it bugs me when people refer to their bishop as “Bish”. I have come to the conclusion that there are two types of people who do this:
1) Good-hearted people who mean absolutely no disrespect, and are just trying to be extra friendly, or playful, by sounding more casual. Totally understandable – especially if you are good friends with the man, or trying to be. It is weird to be screaming at referees with him on Saturday night, only to be referring to him by title on Sunday morning.
2) Less good-hearted people who seek to mock, or diminish the title or the man holding it. I kid you not. I did a quick Google search (so that you don’t have to), and found the term “bish” on many ‘ex-mormon’ sites, always used in a condescending manner.
The other thing I found is that ‘bish’ is also a casual abbreviation of a profanity that most of us associate with Joy Behar.
So, to those good-hearted people who are trying to be friendly, I would suggest that you use the title correctly. Also, I know that not every bishop is adored, but even if we don’t necessarily like the man, we should still respect the title.
Also, another tiny detail, then a story…
“Let’s ask Bishop what he thinks”. WRONG
“Let’s ask the Bishop what he thinks.” RIGHT
“Let’s ask Bishop Jones what he thinks.” RIGHT.
Remember, ‘Bishop’ is not his first name, it is his title. (yes, I know this is nit-picking, but I’m on a roll.) Of course everyone knows someone whose last name was Bishop. Bishop Bishop is still funny. As is Elder Elder, or even Elder Young.
A few years back, James E. Faust gave a great talk entitled “Called and Chosen”. (link here) In it, he told a story that I think serves as a great reminder as to how we should consider the men that are serving in positions of leadership. Here is the story, and any of you serving in ward councils or bishoprics might want to remember this as you plan activities that put demands on your bishop.
President Faust:
Here
Thank you for this. We live in a world that too often trifles with sacred things and many have forgotten that even in the casual world we live in, there are still things that shouldn’t be trivialized or made common. Another abbreviation that makes me cringe is “Gs” for garments. Very disrespectful, in my opinion.
I have a former bishop whom I call ” Bish-pop”. He was the father of our Ward, and like a surrogate father to me. I feel great respect and admiration for him and he will always be Bish-pop to me!
What do you think about the whole Brother Jones and Sister Smith thing? I hate to call people who are just my friends when I am looking for speakers and say this is Brother Johnson when if I need to borrow the weed wacker I’m just Chris.
Leslie: Don’t just wait and see how it goes – email the talk to the Bishopric. You are entitled to do that as a member of the Ward Council.
Thought of this post just last Sunday (and got around to telling you today) when I was in ward council and we were discussing that as part of our auction we should have people bid on who gets to throw a pie in the bishopric’s faces.
Only one person agreed with me that it might be disrespectful. The rest assured me that it was all in good fun. We’ll see how it goes…
I raised my hand to sustain. That means: Respect, ever. Disrespect, never. Simple.
I’ll admit that I sometimes drop “the” when talking about my bishop. I know I’m doing it and I know I shouldn’t, but sometimes it’s just easier to use bad grammar.
At least I have NEVER called a bishop “Bish”…
I went back and read your previous posts in this series and I love it because you have touched on things that drive me crazy. Another one that bugs me is when people use the phrase “saying my prayers.” It makes it sound like vain repetition.
We had Elder English and Elder French as companions in our Japanese mission. That was always interesting on a door approach.
Paul: Haven’t heard much from you lately, but I can count on you for a dose of wisdom.
Anon: I don’t have a problem with D&C, but then I’m not a gynecologist, or a woman. Oddly, I do feel uncomfortable with the BOM acronym.
Love your this series of posts! I hope you write one on saying “D&C” rather than “Doctrine and Covenants!”
Totally agree!
Shortly after my call as bishop in our present ward, Elder Jay Jensen taught a similar principle in a stake leadership meeting. It was good for me to here as a new bishop in the ward. (I had never thought much of titles and was not growing into the “Bishop” title very comfortably.)
There is a fine line a bishop walks, trying to honor the calling and yet not distance himself too much from his flock (particularly the youth). There’s no harm in the formality as long as the ward members also feel his love at the same time.
I have the utmost respect for my Bishop … and have never called him BISH … I will be honest though, once … I called him BJ … which was short for Bishop Jones … I have since repented.
My mission president would not let us say “guys” when speaking of the elders, or getting dunked about baptism, etc. He also said if anyone said “leadership was a curse” they got their temple recommend away. How can you serve a mission with out a temple recommend? Any way, “pres” wasn’t acceptable either, although he never said that. It was a given.
First they’re anti-dunk tank, next they’re going to tell us it’s not OK to T.P. the Bishop’s house. Killjoys!
I prefer to call our bishop “Your Grace”.
Slightly ashamed that I didn’t hear or remember this originally from President Faust. I confess I fall into the first category, which is I tend to be too casual, even to the point of walking the line of slight inappropriateness (I do this to ensure tht my husband, who is a saint that I am not worthy of, never gets called as the Bishop). Makes it even harder that our neighbor and best friend of 24 years is now our Bishop. I keep slipping and calling him Scooter.
(air knuckles to “Utahn”)…(or is it “the Uthan”, I digress)
MMM, thank you for the education:)
I love your “stop saying that” posts. I spent 15 min in a youth lesson on the proper pronunciation of Patriarchal blessing.
Hey, I just thought of something, now if someone googles Joy Behar,your blog will come up.
I just barely told someone how funny I thought it was that my friend says “Where’s Bishop?” Instead of “Where’s the bishop?” or “Where’s Bishop Jones?” The person I mentioned it to disagreed with me, which surprised me.
Do you know what I have often been tempted to do when I know a bishop really well? Call them “Bishop” with their first name, such as “Bishop John.” After all, Joseph Smith was called “Brother Joseph.”
Totally agree…and while it’s on the subject of respect, my husband and I were taught that when you meet with the Bishop, (example tithing settlement) you dress in your Sunday attire.
Out of respect. (and he is dressed that way also.)
Here in Nevada, we have received a lot of comments each year for it! We were shocked to see and hear so many other families make fun of us for doing this, or have bishopric members tell us we don’t need to wear church attire.
Really sad I say.
One more thing: if one of our friends has a title, we call them that in church settings, or at church. If we are casually hanging out, we use their first name, or whatever we call them. What do you guys think of that!?! : )
I’ve heard Bish before, though not in a long time. I’ll confess my own sin, however. When I lived in Ohio I was in a branch. Our branch president was President Wilson, an absolute wonderful man, and a man for whom I had immense respect. I coined the phrase “P.W.” It really rolled off the tongue (“pee double-ya”), and was soon picked up by not only 1/2 the branch, but the entire Kentucky Louisville Mission. President Wilson never said a word. Just a couple months ago his daughter in law was visiting Utah and we had lunch. She told me he HATED that. Man, I feel like such a jerk.
Agree totally. From my experience when serving as a Bishop, the occasions I did hear “Bish” was from saints who were in category 2. You can just tell when someone is trying to be demeaning.
These Plates not those plates
I’ve only heard the word “bish” used for one person who had the last name of a type of fish. So they called him bish fish. But at the time he was not bishop anymore, but an institute instructor. Anyway, it was used out of love and familiarity but I never called him that. And that’s the only time I’ve heard it.
On the other hand, what I’ve noticed living in UT is that people talk about families using their last names, but without an article. So, for instance, they’ll say something like, “Have you gone over to Smiths?” Meaning, “Have you gone over to THE Smiths?” Or “Larsens are out of town.” THE Larsens. So when I hear “Let’s ask Bishop what he thinks,” it all sounds like part of the same deal where people are dropping the “the” and I feel like they are purposefully trying to drive me from the state with these crazy linguistic shenanigans!
I have never heard anyone call a Bishop, “bish” before. That is very disrespectful. I’ve never heard that story by Pres. Faust before either. I completely agree. I would have felt the same way his father felt.
I usually hear the shortened version by the teenage boys, along with ‘bish’ comes ‘pres’ and ‘teach’. Looks like we need to start teaching our teenagers.
Thanks for the reminder.
I must be living under a rock. I had never thought about back scratching (because I never noticed it I guess and/or there wasn’t any crazy backscratching going on). Also, I have never heard anyone call the Bishop “Bish”
Either I have a bad memory or a pretty good ward. 🙂 Haha.
Signed
Utahn
Just the other day I was talking to my mother-in-law about a small thing that women in another ward or stake near her had been asked to do. A lot of people got riled up about it, and I could see there being a problem if they stopped you before coming into church and made sure you were doing said thing. But I just thought of it as some extra direction from a local leader that you could take or leave, but you would be blessed for doing your best to follow. I really do try to follow the counsel my bishops give, even if I disagree and I know that I will be blessed.
I remember a bishop in my BYU student ward asking us to have a meal together with other students in our ward every week. There was a whole plan charted out so you would have dinner with everyone in the ward by the end of it all. I complained and moaned and groaned about it because I was shy, because it stressed me out and I was feeling stingy with my limited food budget. Then I talked to a guy I was dating who helped me realize that our Bishop had asked this of us and I could be blessed if I followed willingly, even if I hated the idea. (Ok, he made me feel totally guilty too for being so negative about it!)
Yup, Bish is definitely not ok with me.
This is sort of where I feel a disconnect with saints in highly populated areas….like I’ve NEVER heard anyone in Pennsylvania (or Ohio for that matter or anywhere else I’ve lived) call the Bishop “BISH”! I’ve also lived in DC, and I never heard it. Is this a Utah thing?
A few years ago we had a Christmas party in our ward. Our Bishopric were the three chipmunks and sang a few songs. (with many members and nonmembers in attendance.) It was all in good fun, but I remember coming home and just feeling wrong. When I re-read that talk, I knew why.
I hold great respect for the Priesthood and the worthy men who hold it. I realized that to me this was very belittling of the sacred Priesthood that they hold.
I don’t think that most members would agree, but this is what I came away with. So no, I don’t think you are being nit picky. I fully believe that we should hold great respect for the offices of the Priesthood and those that hold them.
I agree TOTALLY in all respects. Completely!! I hadn’t heard/remembered the quote from Pres. Faust, and that was excellent.
JWW
We love that story by Pres. Faust! When my husband was first called the ward had a history of doing similar things to the bishops in the past that Pres. Faust spoke of in his talk. My husband read it in their PEC meeting (and again in Ward Council) and thankfully, hasn’t been treated as past bishops have been.
Respect the title, respect the calling, if you don’t necessarily respect the man who holds it.